The 396-6.2 swap project

[Barrman]

I had an all metal shroud from something in the 1960's. It wouldn't fit my radiator, was too long to clear anything on the engine and was totally wrong for the hoses. However, it had a nice round barrel and the fan from the 6.2 fit inside.

We cut the barrel off the old mount, made up a new sheet steel radiator face and fabbed up a way to bolt it to the old M715 radiator mount holes. We then had to cut another few inches off the barrel so it would clear all the pulleys.

It seems good turning the fan by hand. We will see what happens when it is making smoke and under a load.

[jeeper]

Tim do you have a picture of the nose cones side by side?

Is the "big mouth 27MT nose cone" actually smaller than the auto tranny nosecone?

I went to bolt my starter in this afternoon only to find my starter doesn't fit either.

I didn't check that before I mounted my engine into the truck.

[Barrman]

I will post a picture tomorrow if I remember. I think the external size is the same though. Most gas engines used something smaller than a 27MT starter. The bell housing for gassers was smaller too at the starter. My bell is a diesel NV4500 bell. Was your bell from a gas or diesel engine?

[jeeper]

My bell is cast iron. I don't really know what it was out of but I suspect a late 50's or early 60's chevy car.

I had to grind it to make it fit my small block 305 starter. The bell housing is the type the starter can bolt to but my 305 starter bolted to the engine instead.

I am afraid I may need to seriously consider swapping bell housings if it looks like I can't grind enough of the bell away. I bought an electric die grinder this evening and will try grinding more away later this week.

[Flingarrows]

I had to grind mine Paul, but it was aluminum

[Barrman]

Yes, your old bell with the starter bolted to it is from no newer than 1963 I believe. For sure, it was not made for a 27MT starter. However, while looking for the nose cone I got, I did come across a few with the bolt to the flywheel pattern. I think they were meant for a Cummins, but that might be an option.

I think grinding is your better bet though.

We still have the starter on the GP truck and will pull it sometime this week. If you still need pictures I will get them then.

[jeeper]

Thanks for the offer Tim. I guess I don't need any pictures after all.

I'm going to try grinding the bell housing some more. I took a fair amount out to fit the small block starter in. I'll probably need to take about the same or a little more out again. I was able to do it with a 4" grinder before though and it only took a few minutes to remove material that way.

If I do have to pull the bell housing I may just drop the manual transmission out and put my 700 auto in anyway.

[jeeper]

I was able to spend a few minutes out in the garage tonight.

I ground the bell housing out and am able to fit my direct drive starter in but not my gear reduction starter. I haven't tried cranking the engine over yet with the direct drive starter but it looks like it will be fine.

The gear reduction starter hits the flywheel before the bolt holes line up. I really wanted to use the 6.5 starter. there must be a different part number for a manual transmission 6.5 starter?

[randyscycle]

Yes, your old bell with the starter bolted to it is from no newer than 1963 I believe.

A number of the old 6 cylinders had bell housings that used the bolt in type starters. I had a 1970 Chevy C10 with a 250 that was bought new by my uncle (still have it too!) that had the starter that bolted into the bell housing from the front and not to a pad on the block. Those 6 cylinders also had the 12 inch clutch and large bell housing and will bolt onto a small or big block V8 too.

[Barrman]

Oh yeah, I forget sometimes they made anything besides V8's. I was thinking 283 being replaced by the 327 and how they changed the bells for the bigger flywheels.



Here is the gulfport truck 6.2 running this morning:
http://imageshack.us/clip/my-videos/...gbpjpirvp.mp4/

Youtube won't let me upload today because I need to update or something like that. I can't update because it is a state computer. I think the video will be embedded. Who knows.

Anyway, it runs so now I can pull the starter and swap out nose cones. Here is a pair of shots of the two nose cones. Auto on the starter and manual on the bench by itself:




Not that big of a difference, but one fits a clutch and the other doesn't.

While trying to get the gulfport truck to run, we learned a few things. Crow foot wrenches fascinate teenagers. They all wanted to use it on the IP lines and could not figure out why they had to keep pulling it off and back on again.

We rigged up the frame mounted electric fuel pump to a 120 volt powered 12v supply. No matter how much pressure it developed, no fuel was getting into the IP bowl. I figured the IP was clogged up. So, we set a world record. Yep, we swapped 2 6.2 IP's between two engines at the same time in 54 minutes. That has to be a world record because I have never read about anybody doing it before.

Turns out we didn't need to do it because the pump turning is what fills the bowl. I thought we could get some flow through to the injectors. Nope, the only way to bleed the lines is by turning the engine. Oh well, they will get a chance to beat there record swapping them back now. Fun!

Once we had fuel, we tried to fire it up. I held a 10 count on the glow plugs and hit the starter. It WHOOMTed and then died. I tried the plugs again and hit the starter. Just turning. Again and again and again. I stopped when the starter got warm. It was an hour later when I realized I had held 24 volts to 12 volt plugs for 10 seconds a time. That first firing was them burning themselves to death.

Only 4 of them came out of the holes after the abuse I gave them. We had to use my home made puller talked about months ago in this thread to get the rest out. I brought in 7 Wellman 070's that were in the bomber until a year or so ago this morning. I think the 8th one is in RED. Anyway, I had 7. We spent a good bit of time playing with the Ohm meter this morning checking those 7 plus the 8 from yesterday out. 2 of the burned yesterday ones checked out just fine on the Ohm meter.

Then we did the glow test. 24 volts to a plug grounded against the block for 3 seconds. Red hot. The students think it is a magic show. Only 7 of the 15 plugs passed the glow test. That is 7 of the 9 that passed the Ohm test. Something to keep in mind if you are checking plugs in an engine. Pull them and put power to them is my suggestion.

It runs and runs nice once off idle. I don't know if it is the IP, the leak at the IP or the leak at the #1 and #3 injectors causing the idle issue. Don't really care either since it is now going to sit until I can save up money to asseble the truck right.

Back to the M715.

We cut a little of the bottom off the valence where the radiator was against it. Now, I can change the belts without pulling the radiator out.

We started messing with installing an oil cooler and started pulling the starter apart before we ran out of time today.